Not a happy chappy

FunkiPhone · Post by **FunkiPhone** » Thu Apr 14, 2011 9:45 am

Morning everyone,

I've had a quick look through previous posts and can't find anything similar but apologies if I'm covering old ground here.

My lease company swaps my Scirocco every 12 months or 8000 miles, which ever comes 1st. Last summer I got a 10 plate 170TDi DSG and absolutely loved it, couldn't believe how quick and un-diesel like it acted and sounded. I got a phone call on Tuesday telling me to come in a swap the car for a new one even through I'd only done 6800 miles. Obviously I was happy as who wouldn't want another new Scirocco. I was even happier when I picked it up and saw it was black. My heart then sank as I walked round the back and saw "BLUE MOTION TECHNOLOGY" on the back.

I've done 150 miles in it and really don't like it. Obviously there's a drop in BHP and torque but the car feels completely different. What other changes does the Blue Motion have from the 170TDi??? Going over bumps it doesn't feel as solid as the old car, its feels like a small car, 'skittish' and uncomposed. Is there a difference in tyres? The engine also sounds a lot more like a diesel than the 170 ever did. I got the 170 with 1100 miles on the clock and 140 has 165 on the clock, will the new engine smooth out after a good run in? I thought engines were broken in at the factory these days? The DSG gearbox also has no idea what to do, its constantly kicking down at the slightest prod of the accelerator where as the 170 just gained speed, quietly.

Very close to asking if they have any 170's left in stock, even if it's not an 11 plate.

trix · Post by **trix** » Thu Apr 14, 2011 10:34 am

Changes... not a lot http://www.sciroccocentral.co.uk/forum/ ... f=4&t=7108" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

S

maisbitt · Post by **maisbitt** » Thu Apr 14, 2011 10:38 am

Ignoring the engine characteristics and drop in power, the car should drive like a 170, in handling at least - unless the bluemotion tech has seriously added weight. The 170 used to be 15kg heavier than the 140 (presumably down to a bigger turbo and beefier clutch).

170 has a bigger turbo, definitely.
170 has uprated injectors

140BM has stop-start
140BM has brake energy regeneration

Physically, the engine block is exactly the same, so it shouldn't sound any less smooth at tickover. The DSG function is likely to be different between the 2 cars. With less power and torque on tap, the DSG is probably wanting to kick-down a lot more often.

If you have a GT the tyres should be just as wide, but it's possible that there are lower rolling reistance tyres on the bluemotions (just guessing - can anyone confirm?

If you used to get a 170 and now you're getting a 140 for the same money - you should feel diddled, the 170 costs more and the residual values that affect lease rates are no worse on the 140 than the 170 to make it a dearer lease.

Unless you're obsessed with getting an extra "real world" 5mpg, insist on a 170. Equipment-wise, the only thing you're missing out on if your 140 is a GT is chrome exhaust tips and a red "I" in the TDI badge.

You might notice a change in the newest 170s too - there have been some very small economy gains, not sure whether they've tweaked the map or if it has gained brake regen but not the rest of the bluemotion stuff.

FunkiPhone · Post by **FunkiPhone** » Thu Apr 14, 2011 10:58 am

Thanks guys. I'm doing a 500 miles round trip to London this weekend, If I'm still unhappy with after that then I'll either ask for a 170 (if they have any) or a reduced monthly payment.

Other small changes if anyone's interested between 2010 and 2011 models are that the steering wheel is slightly thinner, I noticed that straight away, the DSG gear knob is no longer chrome on top and when connected to my iPhone and scrolling through albums I keep getting 'Please Wait' whilst its loading them. Didn't happen in the 170.

maisbitt · Post by **maisbitt** » Thu Apr 14, 2011 11:37 am

Funki - get it changed, don't even think about it. Should they not have forewarned you that they were swapping your car out for a lower model? I suppose last years prices for a 170TDI compare with this years prices for a 140GT bluemotion (VAT and VW rise), so you got the same spent on the car for the same monthly rental (assuming they didn't up your rate).

Seems odd to me that you don't get the car from new - 1100 miles already on the last one makes me think someone else got it first and dropped out of the agreement after having it a month or so.

Those other small changes just look like a bit of VW penny-pinching to me. The steering wheel rim is thin enough already.

FunkiPhone · Post by **FunkiPhone** » Thu Apr 14, 2011 12:32 pm

Maisbitt - I would kick up a fuss but my lease contract isn't a standard one. Its through a company I used to work for, part of their business was internet car rentals and their company cars were the left overs from bigger leasing companies that had cars sat there not making money. Hence why they get swapped so often.

When I left that company and went it alone they said I could stay on the same deal for £315 a month. I shouldn't really grumble but I'm missing those 30 horses!

mortc002 · Post by **mortc002** » Thu Apr 14, 2011 2:54 pm

I like the sound of this 12 motnh leasing agreement can you offer any info on this ?

Sootchucker · Post by **Sootchucker** » Thu Apr 14, 2011 6:45 pm

Well, at the risk of being scorned by the 170 crowd, I've had my 140 BM for 2 weeks now and think it's superb. The DSG is extremely precise and unlike yours, takes a decent poke to get a kickdown in D mode (slightly less in S mode).

As for smoothness and noise, it's the first thing I noticed after trading in my beloved MK5 Golf GT TDI (with the PD engine). By that I mean how quiet and totally smooth it was. Even after 2 weeks, I still sometimes find it hard to believe it's actually a diesel. As for handling, not the slightest bit skittish at all, in fact it's absolutely superb.

The only thing (in my view at least) it's missing is a few ponies under the bonnet,b ut compared to my old mapped (185hp) Golf, it's surprising me how small the difference appears to me in everyday driving (unless you are into full bore traffic light get aways)

Your to be honest, sounds nothing like mine at all.

As for the tyres, they are exaclty the same as all the other engines. No low rolling resistance stuff here. The only difference may be that VW recently went to self sealing tyres, which may be part of the difference you are experiencing ?

bianco · Post by **bianco** » Thu Apr 14, 2011 6:59 pm

It is a possibility that the BlueMotion version is delivered on harder tyres, to get higher milage.

Sootchucker · Post by **Sootchucker** » Thu Apr 14, 2011 7:32 pm

Nope, I checked Jammyd's car when he was here last week (he has a 170 GT TDI), and his tyres were exactly the same as mine, Pirelli P7 self sealing 235 /40/18's ?

jammyd · Post by **jammyd** » Thu Apr 14, 2011 9:54 pm

Yeah both had exactly same tyres on! 170 and 140 from we think the same build week

maisbitt · Post by **maisbitt** » Fri Apr 15, 2011 8:49 am

Until you're in a situation where you'd otherwise be using those extra 30 horses, the 140 GT will drive pretty much the same as the 170 GT, the engine certainly shouldn't sound any less smooth, it will just be lacking in poke in 5th and 6th when compared with the 170. If the tyres are the same, then handling won't be any different either as the weight distribution is the same (15kg extra kerb weight won't do anything to the handling a user would notice).

For those who buy a 140 as a compromise when they really want a 170, it's a bit of a false economy if you start thinking about remaps etc later. For the extra £760 list price of the 170, you'll get 1/2 of that back come trade in (based on those who swap every 3 years) vs £300-400 cost of a remap. Insurance implications are huge too, someone on here pays £180 a year extra for the fact their 140 is remapped to 170, compared to about £30 a year extra insurance for a factory 170 vs 140.

If you're first concern is getting an extra 5mpg and you're not bothered about the extra performance then get the 140BM, otherwise, get the 170.

It can't be long before BM tech is fully rolled out to the 170 - the Passat CC 170TDI has full bluemotion and it's CO2 is at 129g/km. In a Roc, it would realistically be about 125g/km, with a bit of tinkering, maybe they could get it below the magic 120g/km.

If you're persistently stuck in traffic jams, the BM tech will really help up your economy, and you won't get to use the 170's extra poke. BM tech doesn't do a lot for motorway milers though - if you're not stop-starting and not having to brake often then the BM tech will be doing nowt.

Sootchucker · Post by **Sootchucker** » Fri Apr 15, 2011 1:50 pm

Yep, pretty much agree with everything maisbitt said above.

Scott_mac · Post by **Scott_mac** » Sun Apr 17, 2011 11:05 am

Big difference for company cars though... you'll be paying a healthy chunk more in tax each month for a 170 over the 140, BM makes a lot of sense for fleet drivers - not sure if the OP is still driving it as a company car though, not quite clear.

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